[Bonanzoid]

I actually struggle to believe people defending them, how can you? People were saying it was 'banter', but you listen to it and it's clear it wasn't and the fact they've held their hands up and said they were stupid shows an admission of guilt. It wasn't even the first time Andy Gray had been busted being a sexist douche, so he deserved to go. I've no sympathy.

He's always been a crass, smarmy, ridiculous excuse for a pundit so I'm glad he's gone. As for Richard Keys, he was in the wrong too, but I'm glad he wasn't sacked but I think to save face resigning was probably a good move.

The severity of the comments wasn't that bad, however they'd have been well aware that getting caught saying stuff like that would land them in hot water, so it's their own stupidity.

[Boboff]

I agree 100% with Chris.

That Boots advert gets in my nerves.

As a "house husband" I do take it a bit to heart I know, but it annoys me that it can be considered acceptable to sterotype men as being in bed with a cold, when the lovelies are out working, shopping, decorating and having the in-laws round. Why can't the media work out that a good relationship is a partnership?

All this is crap.

We all get "jokes" on our mobile phones which are more racist, sexist, offensive than anything that was said. We all understand that nearly all are not even funny, and as Yuds said, repeat them at work at your peril..... but why should we take ourselves all so bloody seriously, that a bit of "banter" should mean they loose thier jobs.

If a man belives he is better than a woman, then he is a sexist, if he believes a woman is different to a man, he is correct.

Replace the word woman with the words, Gay, Black, Disabled, Man, then you still get an "ist" but chances are he will always be different.

The only exception I can really think of is Nick Clegg, be you black, white, man, woman, gay or straight he is a two faced lying wanker.

[chrysostom]

would it be sexist to say that women at the highest end of professional football are not as good as men at the highest end of professional football?

I've watched a fair bit of women's football, and I can say that for a number of reasons this is true, but just two of the reasons are partly due to physical stature and partly to do with the difference in training that the athletes get.

[MK Chris]

Let me first say that it was very sexist and I don't agree with it at all.

However, there was an ulterior motive for sacking Andy Gray and that is that he is suing the News of the World for hacking into his phone. I believe that's the reason for the leak. Also, The New Statesman has a good analysis of it from a Sky insider.

[bmstinton93]

would it be sexist to say that women at the highest end of professional football are not as good as men at the highest end of professional football?

I've watched a fair bit of women's football, and I can say that for a number of reasons this is true, but just two of the reasons are partly due to physical stature and partly to do with the difference in training that the athletes get.

No its just cause women generally don't have as much stamina or athleticism. That's why they only play 3 sets in tennis compared to the 5 that men play

[McGuinness-89]

Let me first say that it was very sexist and I don't agree with it at all.

However, there was an ulterior motive for sacking Andy Gray and that is that he is suing the News of the World for hacking into his phone. I believe that's the reason for the leak. Also, The New Statesman has a good analysis of it from a Sky insider.

Agree with everything you just typed.

[Boboff]

This is all rubbish.

The different sexes are well different.

Nurses in general are filthy minded, :0)

[dimtimjim]

If a man belives he is better than a woman, then he is a sexist

Hello!

[Yudster]

Let me first say that it was very sexist and I don't agree with it at all.

However, there was an ulterior motive for sacking Andy Gray and that is that he is suing the News of the World for hacking into his phone. I believe that's the reason for the leak. Also, The New Statesman has a good analysis of it from a Sky insider.

I think that's nonsense. Well, maybe it isn't complete nonsense, but to say that is the reason for sacking Gray and only disciplining Keys is wrong. They disciplined them both for the various incidents on that match day, and then when it was found that Gray had got a history of making revolting suggestions to his female co-workers he was sacked. I believe that if there were such complaints about Keys he too would have been sacked on the spot.

[MK Chris]

Youtube videos had surfaced of Keys referring to women as 'it', saying to Jamie Redknapp 'I bet you smashed it didn't you'. That's maybe not as bad as Gray's, but still - you have to wonder.

[bmstinton93]

Youtube videos had surfaced of Keys referring to women as 'it', saying to Jamie Redknapp 'I bet you smashed it didn't you'. That's maybe not as bad as Gray's, but still - you have to wonder.

I think that's worse than what Gray did. I actually see that as disrespectful and out of order but I don't think Gray really did much wrong

[wireman2004]

How many of you have at some point said one of the following.

A comment towards a woman which could be considered sexiest
A comment towards a Man which could be considered sexiest
Said too someone They would (in keys words) Smash it. (I have management who say that)
Said too someone that they are a dog.

All the points is a general summary of what has happened too andy grey and richard keys.

It was a private comment between mates and would be considered banter...

We have 18 year old and 19 year old males and females giving it, recieving it and responding too the first all in good banter.


This isn't the fact that it was a sexest comment. It was, but in what they believed too be in good spirits...

It could be that sky wanted them out...


Or has britain's society gone crazy.

[bmstinton93]

How many of you have at some point said one of the following.

A comment towards a woman which could be considered sexiest
A comment towards a Man which could be considered sexiest
Said too someone They would (in keys words) Smash it. (I have management who say that)
Said too someone that they are a dog.

All the points is a general summary of what has happened too andy grey and richard keys.

It was a private comment between mates and would be considered banter...

We have 18 year old and 19 year old males and females giving it, recieving it and responding too the first all in good banter.


This isn't the fact that it was a sexest comment. It was, but in what they believed too be in good spirits...

It could be that sky wanted them out...


Or has britain's society gone crazy.

Britain's society has gone crazy

[Nicola_Red]

How many of you have at some point said one of the following.
A comment towards a Man which could be considered sexiest

My comments towards the men are always the sexiest

[McGuinness-89]

And (someone in) Sky wanted them out.

[Yudster]

The comments we have heard were rude and ignorant, they weren't jovial banter, even if the people saying them were under that impression. And asking a work colleague to stick her had down your trousers is certainly not a jolly fun joke.

I'm not saying there's nothing to the conspiracy theories about Andy Gray and the phone hacking stuff, but even without that you've got grounds for complaint, and employers simply have to act on complaints of that sort. The incident last December with Gray asking a female co-worker to tuck his shirt in on its own, without any of the other stuff, would be plenty to bring gross misconduct proceedings against him. He hasn't got a leg to stand on trying to defend that. And if Keys is embarrassed enough about his part in all this to quit, well, cheerio and don't let the door hit you in the arse on your way out.

[Boboff]

Seriously, get over yourself.

This sory of "its not funny" shit does my head in,

Now, baby doll, come over here and get your laughing tackle round this!

[DevilsDuck]

Its ok, they are going to work for Al Jazeera, so they can say what they like about women out there

[MK Chris]

I'm not saying that's why he was sacked per se, but I do think that's probably the reason it was leaked in the first place, which in turn led to the sacking.

Also - on Question Time last night they had a woman called Katie Hopkins in, who apparently was in The Apprentice once and she was an utterly vile woman. She actually said on equal rights "women don't actually want equal rights - they couldn't handle it if they got it". It was as though she was booked to make Edwina Currie look left wing.

[CassieJackson]

Also - on Question Time last night they had a woman called Katie Hopkins in, who apparently was in The Apprentice once

Urgh, yes I remember her. Didn't like her much at the time.

[Yudster]

I'm not sure what equal rights actually means. In some ways we're doing really well in relation to men - parental leave is an example that springs to mind, how about men demanding equality with women on that one? And some people seem to think equal rights for women would be the argument for women tennis players getting the same prize money as men, when they only play a maximum of 3 games per match and the men play 5.

I do think everyone ought to be able to go to work without being upset by someone else's "banter" though, and given that we can't possibly know what will and won't upset any given individual, we all need to be a bit careful about what we say and to whom we say it - that's all I'm getting at.

[Boboff]

Ah right, now "you" don't find them rude, just someone else?

I know that you like to take the moral highground, but seriously why? They are just men, you know men, stupid innarticulate articles whose knuckles srcape the ground, and like to laugh about willies and burps, and people falling over, and run round point sticks at people making gun noices.

[SAV1OUR]

It's like when someone swears on air (like that never happens in reality) The point is you don't allow it - getting.. erm knickers in twist seems daft, keeps Ofcom in cosy jobs.

Oh and according to the s*n he was barred by paranoid Beeb bosses from talking about it. This sort of thing just breeds fear, evidently.

[Yudster]

Ah right, now "you" don't find them rude, just someone else?

I know that you like to take the moral highground, but seriously why? They are just men, you know men, stupid innarticulate articles whose knuckles srcape the ground, and like to laugh about willies and burps, and people falling over, and run round point sticks at people making gun noices.

Sometimes I find them rude and sometimes not, it depends who it is, how its said and what the intention is - and isn't that where so much conflict is begun? From assuming that you're ok to say what you might say to (for instance) me, who would laugh it off and give back some of the same, to someone else, who for all you know might take offence, make a totally justified complaint and cause you to lose your job?

I'm not taking the moral high ground at all Boboff, I'm just pointing out what the position is in terms of what is and isn't allowable in the workplace under current legislation, and what people should be aware of when they assume that being a "bloke" will cover them against a charge of harrassment or discrimination or bullying in the workplace. All you need is someone who knows a bit about the law and isn't afraid to insist that your HR department applies it and you've got a minefield there.

From what I heard of the Andy Gray stuff though, yes, I think it was pretty revolting and went over my personal line. I'm not sure where that line is in relation to anyone else's, but in terms of the law its a fairly long way out. He sounded like a right pig. Which is not the same as a bloke.

[Boboff]

How does off air questioning a persons ability to do a job make him a pig, how does suggesting that a female tuck in his mike make him a pig, HOW??? They might be out at the Pub on a Friday being allot more "vile" than that, she didn't complain, it wasn't rude, he didn't get his willy out and force her to stroke it......

This does happen, people are being treated badly all over this country, and we don't punish them, what Gray said was not and can never be seen as him being a "pig" You have taken the presses angle on it, justified it with your knowledge of the Public Sector HR zealots and come up with something so far from reality that it stinks.

It's not a personal attack, sorry, you know I love you, but I feel that this whole "middle england" "disgusted of Milton Keynes" shit has gone too far, you are a minoity of people, you control the media, and you think that you deserve the preservation of your "MIdsummer" life, when 85% of people in towns and cities live with poverty, abuse, and daily conversations involving allot more swearing, bigotry and sexism than Grey could even dream off.

It was said off air, it was an opinion, right or wrong, he is entitled to one of those, he is entitled to talk and joke, it would seam however that persuing a claim for breach of privacy against Murdoch however means that even the good old BBC can get in on the act. You wait, I bet that Sue Barker, is a right old dirty bitch when she gets going.

Having been to a few Rugby Internationals etc when they get players who commentate on the TV to do a bit of After Dinner speaking, no names, no pack drill, I feal pretty sure if they looked at a few of these, it wouldn't be long before the only people commentating on Telly were priests.