[Vivienne]

God, you're annoying Console!!!! Like I said before, whether in a PM or on the Board, if you think there is no purpose/point/meaning to life, why bother with any of it? The fact that you don't just jump into the sea means that something is pulling you back, and making you go on in your life - because your life has a purpose (and you are here to do something) - even if it is not yet apparent.

[Bruvva]

If there was only good stuff happening, you wouldn't appreciate good things happening to you, bruvva. I think certain bad things that happen are meant to be, for whatever reason.

Doesn't that strike you as odd behaviour though? It's like saying to your child "I'm going to give you a bar of chocolate but to make sure you appreciate it, I'm going to throw you into this patch of nettles first".

[Console]

The fact that you don't just jump into the sea means that something is pulling you back, and making you go on in your life

No it doesn't, I just don't see a point in 'jumping in the sea' (although, as I can swim, I doubt much would happen other than getting wet). Meaninglessness doesn't mean that everything should just end, it just means that it has no meaning.

[Vivienne]

I think you're being a tad ridiculous, Bruvva. On a grand scale, if there were only good days all the time, there would indeed be no purpose.

[Vivienne]

The fact that you don't just jump into the sea means that something is pulling you back, and making you go on in your life

No it doesn't, I just don't see a point in 'jumping in the sea' (although, as I can swim, I doubt much would happen other than getting wet). Meaninglessness doesn't mean that everything should just end, it just means that it has no meaning.

It has no meaning? Yet, you choose to go to work, you choose to work with computers developing stuff? Why bother? Why bother being nice to your family? Why bother with Xmas? Why bother with anything, Console? You bother, because you secretly know there is something bigger out there.

[Bruvva]

I think you're being a tad ridiculous, Bruvva. On a grand scale, if there were only good days all the time, there would indeed be no purpose.

No more ridiculous than your assertions that some higher force is making me be nice to people and stopping Console jumping into the sea.

[Vivienne]

yet, you make the choice not to do nasty things to your family/friends? Why bother? You choose to go down the good path, so there are indeed good forces at work in you.

[Console]

Yet, you choose to go to work, you choose to work with computers developing stuff? Why bother?

I 'bother' because I enjoy doing things. You forget though, I believe in determinism; I can't change what's going to happen anymore than I can change what has already happened. What will be, will be; there doesn't have to be meaning for there to be a future.

Why bother being nice to your family?

What makes you think I'm nice to my family?

You bother, because you secretly know there is something bigger out there.

You're really struggling now aren't you?

[MK Chris]

I don't believe there is a "god" (though I don't think anyone can be 100% certain, which kind of makes me agnostic, but I would say I am 99.5% certain).

I think life itself is an amazing thing that we are very lucky to have. It's all part of the Goldilocks Enigma.

[Console]

yet, you make the choice not to do nasty things to your family/friends? Why bother?

Why bother not to do nasty things? Why bother to do nasty things?

You choose to go down the good path

As I don't believe in a 'good path' I haven't made a concious choice to go down it.

[Vivienne]

I'm not struggling at all! I just see a young man who cannot believe in anything greater, for whatever reason.

You buy your mum Xmas pressies. Why bother? Why not just tell her to get lost? No purpose to Xmas after all?

[Console]

I just see a young man who cannot believe in anything greater, for whatever reason.

The reason is that it doesn't make sense to believe in a higher power with absolutely no proof. Now, logically that should make a person agnostic, but my belief in determinism pushes my beliefs sharply into atheism.

You buy your mum Xmas pressies. Why bother?

I think you've made a false connection between meaning and life; life doesn't have to have a purpose.

Why not just tell her to get lost?

Why tell her to get lost?

No purpose to Xmas after all?

Wasn't the purpose of Christmas to convert a Pagan festival into a Christian one (and simultaneously convert Pagans into Christians)?

It's all part of the Goldilocks Enigma.

Is that the 'just right mix' one?

[Bruvva]

yet, you make the choice not to do nasty things to your family/friends? Why bother? You choose to go down the good path, so there are indeed good forces at work in you.

No, it's just my choice to be nice. I'm in control of what I do, not some external forces.

[Vivienne]

I'm right, Console. Life does have to have a purpose. As I've said before, only soul-less people believe life has no purpose.

[Vivienne]

yet, you make the choice not to do nasty things to your family/friends? Why bother? You choose to go down the good path, so there are indeed good forces at work in you.

No, it's just my choice to be nice. I'm in control of what I do, not some external forces.

this is my point, I'm right!! You think you are in control, but you aren't... life is a pre-planned event.

[Console]

As I've said before, only soul-less people believe life has no purpose.

But, as the soul doesn't exist, all people are soul-less.

[Bruvva]

this is my point, I'm right!! You think you are in control, but you aren't... life is a pre-planned event.

No you're not. How does me saying I'm in control of my own destiny prove your point at all?

[Vivienne]

But the soul does exist. The body is just the physical thing for us to go about in on this Earth.

I'll tell you... it's lucky I've got my radio with me, else I would have missed The Mills (also created by a higher force).

[Vivienne]

this is my point, I'm right!! You think you are in control, but you aren't... life is a pre-planned event.

No you're not. How does me saying I'm in control of my own destiny prove your point at all?

I am right!! You saying you are in control of your destiny is false! You're not! You think you are making decisions, but they have already been decided for you!

[Console]

But the soul does exist.

Prove it.

[Vivienne]

And how am I supposed to do that? Prove it doesn't!!!

[Bruvva]

I am right!! You saying you are in control of your destiny is false! You're not! You think you are making decisions, but they have already been decided for you!

So none of us are in control of our own actions at all? So I can go and kill Will Smith and just say "the dark forces made me do it, they shouted louder than the good ones"?

[Vivienne]

If you're daft enough to do it, it's not my responsibility.

[Console]

And how am I supposed to do that? Prove it doesn't!!!

It's impossible to prove that something doesn't exist. Just try proving that there's not fish out there somewhere that speaks French.

If you're daft enough to do it, it's not my responsibility.

Why would he have to be daft, he was being controlled by other forces, it wasn't his fault.

[MK Chris]

It's all part of the Goldilocks Enigma.

Is that the 'just right mix' one?

Yep.

yet, you make the choice not to do nasty things to your family/friends? Why bother? You choose to go down the good path, so there are indeed good forces at work in you.

No, it's just my choice to be nice. I'm in control of what I do, not some external forces.

this is my point, I'm right!! You think you are in control, but you aren't... life is a pre-planned event.

This post reminded me of this:
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lSYV4-S89d0][/youtube]